General Stream Discussion [Former: Dual Stream discussion]

Edit history:

Edenal: 2014-01-05 09:22:27 pm

j4sp3rr: 2013-11-21 04:15:48 pm

j4sp3rr: 2013-11-21 03:59:37 pm

2013-11-21 03:57:33 pm

Since a lot of discussion has been made over at facebook over the Double stream suggestion/issue/ whatever you want to call it at this point we decided to make a post on the forums, so here it is, discuss away i guess, i do however want to add a few quick points made by a few people over on the facebook thread:

Quote from Partystar:

Although it would solve for the amount of games that are gonna be proposed. But I see situations in which a popular game attracts all attention and the other game simply has no chance to get people watching. For example, Donkey Kong Country Returns makes no chance against Ocarina of Time or Mario 64. Or when a runner has popularity, the other runner is put in shadow

Quote from KVD:

A solution to this would be to preclude double streaming during the really big slots (adam_ak, ennopp, etc), whilst having a double stream planned for slots with a little less gravity / mass hysteria appeal (which I dare say is the majority of slots, no offense).

KVD's post was replied by Partystar again with this:

Quote from Partystar:

Or putting all longer games, say games longer than 5 hour, in the alternate stream. In that way, game selection doesn't have to sacrifice time for a long game nor does it require long games being excluded from a marathon. But it is still tricky, since a popular long game, will take away all attention for many hours. A bunch of nes games and indie games, hence even relative popular games will lose their showcase against a popular long game such as GTA or Final Fantasy.

Quote from j4sp3rr:

the double stream does allow for more games, which is cool, but does it really allow more games to be seen is the big question, as he said, bigger games with bigger personalities behind them, say for example robo sparkle with batman, which drain the viewers away from the other stream for example, sure there is multi twitch, but i myself know that this is not the solution because having 2 streams with audio open is not the best solution in the world. I don't think this is the best option for the somewhat understated or smaller games, unless executed really well, which honestly, is going to insanely hard to do and possibly harder than we can manage, i would like to help out where i can though, if i am able to help out in this section(which is mainly going to be planning the games on the two stream accordingly i guess)

Quote from CursedDolls:

As long as it's not getting to messy, that would be my fear. I mean I have not even seen *GDQ done this stunt yet.

these are opinions currently being posted on the facebook, i would like to hear your opinions too/maybe some transparency/possibly tips or ideas to get the dual stream executed as well as possible to our abilities!(or if it might be better to not execute it at all)

Thread title:

Since a lot of discussion has been made over at facebook over the Double stream suggestion/issue/ whatever you want to call it at this point we decided to make a post on the forums, so here it is, discuss away i guess, i do however want to add a few quick points made by a few people over on the facebook thread:

[quote="Partystar"]Although it would solve for the amount of games that are gonna be proposed. But I see situations in which a popular game attracts all attention and the other game simply has no chance to get people watching. For example, Donkey Kong Country Returns makes no chance against Ocarina of Time or Mario 64. Or when a runner has popularity, the other runner is put in shadow[/quote]

[quote="KVD"]A solution to this would be to preclude double streaming during the really big slots (adam_ak, ennopp, etc), whilst having a double stream planned for slots with a little less gravity / mass hysteria appeal (which I dare say is the majority of slots, no offense).[/quote]

KVD's post was replied by Partystar again with this:
[quote="Partystar"]Or putting all longer games, say games longer than 5 hour, in the alternate stream. In that way, game selection doesn't have to sacrifice time for a long game nor does it require long games being excluded from a marathon. But it is still tricky, since a popular long game, will take away all attention for many hours. A bunch of nes games and indie games, hence even relative popular games will lose their showcase against a popular long game such as GTA or Final Fantasy.[/quote]

[quote="j4sp3rr"]the double stream does allow for more games, which is cool, but does it really allow more games to be seen is the big question, as he said, bigger games with bigger personalities behind them, say for example robo sparkle with batman, which drain the viewers away from the other stream for example, sure there is multi twitch, but i myself know that this is not the solution because having 2 streams with audio open is not the best solution in the world. I don't think this is the best option for the somewhat understated or smaller games, unless executed really well, which honestly, is going to insanely hard to do and possibly harder than we can manage, i would like to help out where i can though, if i am able to help out in this section(which is mainly going to be planning the games on the two stream accordingly i guess)[/quote]

[quote="CursedDolls"]As long as it's not getting to messy, that would be my fear. I mean I have not even seen *GDQ done this stunt yet.[/quote]

these are opinions currently being posted on the facebook, i would like to hear your opinions too/maybe some transparency/possibly tips or ideas to get the dual stream executed as well as possible to our abilities!(or if it might be better to not execute it at all)

curseddolls

2013-11-21 04:03:08 pm

100% gamer

Yes that's me.

ozzy88

2013-11-21 09:48:46 pm

First of all, this is pretty much going to happen unless we find it practically impossible to do. We really want to give this a try!

It is good to keep a discussion for how to avoid the biggest problems we find with it and I think we all agree with that.

I kind of like what KVD is saying. That would mean some hyped up "main events" but the majority of the marathon would still go with two active streams. In any case, just think about the local attendees who most likely will want to watch it, that possibly leaves some unfortunate runner lonely with low viewer count on the stream he/she is playing on.

...too tired to keep thinking at the moment. But that's at least the initial thoughts I have for now.

j4sp3rr

2013-11-21 10:15:59 pm

yes the main events is a really great idea and should definitely be realized imho, we just have to see how this works out in time but we definitely need to think this through as much as possible

Edenal

2013-11-22 12:04:02 am

These are my personal opinions and they are not shared with everyone.

For this purpose, let's name the streams: Sega-stream and Nintendo-stream. (Blue and Red :) )

I'm not in favor for having the one stream running "only" when there is not a big run on the other stream. It's bound to hurt someone's feelings when their game is deemed less important, and I'm not sure those runners who are by some viewed as "main attraction" wants that distinction or attention. If there's not speedgaming to fill two streams 24/7 I believe that we would shut down one of the streams during graveyard shifts, but I really don't see that happening. There's bound to be someone who will not mind playing a 12 hour RPG during those hours.

There will be conflicts on the schedule, but in a way I feel that anything that makes the final schedule should have an audience, not matter if [Super popular game] is running strong on the other stream. During a normal week you compete with faaar more streams for viewers. If you happen to be in the situation that you are running a game on the Sega-stream which currently has 3000 viewers, and 20,000 on the Nintendo-stream. Your focus should be on giving those 3000 viewers the best experience, not worrying about what's going on at the Nintendo-stream.

One game on the less popular stream is better than no game at all? And there are other things to do at ESA than to play games on the stream :)

There are lots of things we can do to try to balance the streams. The most important thing is to make sure the viewers knows about BOTH streams. Balance the Marios, Zeldas and Metroid across both streams. Maybe in a way where we would actually want the Blue-stream to have a higher viewer count during the first day, then slowly move the focus and action to the Red stream.

These are my personal opinions and they are not shared with everyone.

For this purpose, let's name the streams: Sega-stream and Nintendo-stream. (Blue and Red :) )

I'm not in favor for having the one stream running "only" when there is not a big run on the other stream. It's bound to hurt someone's feelings when their game is deemed less important, and I'm not sure those runners who are  by some viewed as "main attraction" wants that distinction or attention. If there's not speedgaming to fill two streams 24/7 I believe that we would shut down one of the streams during graveyard shifts, but I really don't see that happening. There's bound to be someone who will not mind playing a 12 hour RPG during those hours.

There will be conflicts on the schedule, but in a way I feel that anything that makes the final schedule should have an audience, not matter if [Super popular game] is running strong on the other stream. During a normal week you compete with faaar more streams for viewers. If you happen to be in the situation that you are running a game on the Sega-stream which currently has 3000 viewers, and 20,000 on the Nintendo-stream. Your focus should be on giving those 3000 viewers the best experience, not worrying about what's going on at the Nintendo-stream.

One game on the less popular stream is better than no game at all? And there are other things to do at ESA than to play games on the stream :)

There are lots of things we can do to try to balance the streams. The most important thing is to make sure the viewers knows about BOTH streams. Balance the Marios, Zeldas and Metroid across both streams. Maybe in a way where we would actually want the Blue-stream to have a higher viewer count during the first day, then slowly move the focus and action to the Red stream.

j4sp3rr

Edit history:

j4sp3rr: 2013-11-22 01:08:55 am

j4sp3rr: 2013-11-22 01:08:53 am

2013-11-22 01:08:30 am

interesting point edenal, but as you said they are not shared with everyone, and i think runners would sort of be offended just the same if they knew all the hype was over the other game, and as ozzy rightfully points out, the audience in the background(actual ESA attendees) will shift to the main game that is more popular, giving the other stream a more isolated, smaller, less important feeling, something i feel we do not want to cause?

that is just a personal feeling however. i mean it feels so much better having local people hype behind you and supporting you than being alone or with a few people(that is from what i personally would feel more comfortable/happy with though)

Svenne

Edit history:

Svenne: 2013-11-22 02:02:24 am

Svenne: 2013-11-22 02:00:08 am

Svenne: 2013-11-22 01:53:34 am

2013-11-22 01:46:53 am

The way I see it, with one stream not everyone is going to be able to run on ESA, so what is better. But let's take AGDQ 2014, I am not gonna watch the first 2 days because there is not a single game I like there. With this new way of doing it, we will get all forms of speedgaming into our marathon, which is great. And with 2 balanced schedules, it can be done! It's nota bout taking viewers from eachother but getting new onces to come and watch! I mean, ESA2013 viewer top was not even during prime-time: 18-24!

I think with two great opening games from two totaly different spectrums, this will be awesome! Remember, we started on 3k viewers and never got under it pretty much! And with more games, even blind-races we are gonna introduce people to a new dawn of speedgaming! We are doing this for the best for the community, not ourself, or els we would have just done what everyone els is doing. It's worth a shot!

Edit: One idea would be to have more lesser known games gets on the established ESA channel Ludendi which everyone is already following, that would garantee those who are afraid of not getting views viewers durnig their runs. And we need to make a totaly new one for the second stream anyways.

The way I see it, with one stream not everyone is going to be able to run on ESA, so what is better. But let's take AGDQ 2014, I am not gonna watch the first 2 days because there is not a single game I like there. With this new way of doing it, we will get all forms of speedgaming into our marathon, which is great. And with 2 balanced schedules, it can be done! It's nota bout taking viewers from eachother but getting new onces to come and watch! I mean, ESA2013 viewer top was not even during prime-time: 18-24!

I think with two great opening games from two totaly different spectrums, this will be awesome! Remember, we started on 3k viewers and never got under it pretty much! And with more games, even blind-races we are gonna introduce people to a new dawn of speedgaming! We are doing this for the best for the community, not ourself, or els we would have just done what everyone els is doing. It's worth a shot! :smile_orig:

Edit: One idea would be to have more lesser known games gets on the established ESA channel Ludendi which everyone is already following, that would garantee those who are afraid of not getting views viewers durnig their runs. And we need to make a totaly new one for the second stream anyways.

curseddolls

Edit history:

curseddolls: 2013-11-22 08:02:42 am

2013-11-22 08:02:29 am

100% gamer

One question I have is will those two games be run in the same room?
Or will we have two separated rooms for that too?

Edenal

2013-11-22 12:30:50 pm

Quote from curseddolls:

One question I have is will those two games be run in the same room?
Or will we have two separated rooms for that too?

Streams will have to be in the same room.

Quote from j4sp3rr:

interesting point edenal, but as you said they are not shared with everyone, and i think runners would sort of be offended just the same if they knew all the hype was over the other game, and as ozzy rightfully points out, the audience in the background(actual ESA attendees) will shift to the main game that is more popular, giving the other stream a more isolated, smaller, less important feeling, something i feel we do not want to cause?

Try to explain in detail, the reason why a runner would be offended by running his/her game at the same time as someone more popular. Is it envy, discrimination or what do you think?

curseddolls

2013-11-22 01:20:16 pm

100% gamer

Well if they are in the same room people don't have to worry about people getting empty audience in the background but I have to say
have both in same room will feel even more messier. then you will have two diff audiences cheering for two diff things at same time.
two commentaries that will be talking at same time, mixed audio from both crowds in both streams, mixed shoutouts and donations calls on both streams.
a risk of having two players talking in the mouth of each other and interrupting each other.

I just see a lot of things that can lead to messiness.

j4sp3rr

2013-11-22 01:59:07 pm

Quote from curseddolls:

Well if they are in the same room people don't have to worry about people getting empty audience in the background but I have to say
have both in same room will feel even more messier. then you will have two diff audiences cheering for two diff things at same time.
two commentaries that will be talking at same time, mixed audio from both crowds in both streams, mixed shoutouts and donations calls on both streams.
a risk of having two players talking in the mouth of each other and interrupting each other.

I just see a lot of things that can lead to messiness.

having them in the same room will be incredibly messy and to be honest, i dont think this can be realised, it would be too messy with the audio, if one runner would want serious time the other crowd could suddenly start to shout a trick that the other runner just made, mixed shoutouts and donations, commentaries through eachother, it would lead to people not being able to follow any stream anymore and i dont think it is possible to realistically do this in that manner, it would just lead to a really messy and unprofessional stream on both ends...

[quote="curseddolls"]Well if they are in the same room people don't have to worry about people getting empty audience in the background but I have to say
have both in same room will feel even more messier. then you will have two diff audiences cheering for two diff things at same time.
two commentaries that will be talking at same time, mixed audio from both crowds in both streams, mixed shoutouts and donations calls on both streams.
a risk of having two players talking in the mouth of each other and interrupting each other.

I just see a lot of things that can lead to messiness.[/quote]

having them in the same room will be incredibly messy and to be honest, i dont think this can be realised, it would be too messy with the audio, if one runner would want serious time the other crowd could suddenly start to shout a trick that the other runner just made, mixed shoutouts and donations, commentaries through eachother, it would lead to people not being able to follow any stream anymore and i dont think it is possible to realistically do this in that manner, it would just lead to a really messy and unprofessional stream on both ends...

Edenal

2013-11-22 02:47:28 pm

Valid concerns. I think you both Cursedolls and j4sp3rr ignored my question.

One of the "problems" we had last year was that runners were too quiet. There wasn't really any commentary prepared or co-commentators assigned for a majority of the games. There are exceptions like the native english guys. The F-zero run also comes to mind when the runner had to focus so KVD took command of commentary.

The audio equipment we had worked very well and did not pick up much (if any) ambiance. Longhair/Niss3/Charleon, do you have anything to add for the audio-tech?
So some hype spilling over to the other stream might not be a bad thing.

When we've discussed the dual stream option with members of the crew who hands on experiences from several marathons. Including AGDQ and C4L we think it's very possible to execute it.

From the hardware point of view, the streams will be setup individually. The only thing that might be shared across both streams is a global announcer mic which could be connected to a separate mixer table. The couches will be positioned with a least 5 meters distance so that you won't really have the other stream in your field of vision.

There were people speaking all the time in the stream room at normal talking levels without runners being distracted. And what about races? Those all worked out fine in all previous marathons? The only potential issue you mention is that it might be messy? Play with the thought that it won't be, where do you stand then?

Valid concerns. I think you both Cursedolls and j4sp3rr ignored my question.

One of the "problems" we had last year was that runners were too quiet. There wasn't really any commentary prepared or co-commentators assigned for a majority of the games. There are exceptions like the native english guys. The F-zero run also comes to mind when the runner had to focus so KVD took command of commentary.

The audio equipment we had worked very well and did not pick up much (if any) ambiance. [b]Longhair/Niss3/Charleon, do you have anything to add for the audio-tech?[/b]
So some hype spilling over to the other stream might not be a bad thing.

When we've discussed the dual stream option with members of the crew who hands on experiences from several marathons. Including AGDQ and C4L we think it's very possible to execute it.

From the hardware point of view, the streams will be setup individually. The only thing that might be shared across both streams is a global announcer mic which could be connected to a separate mixer table. The couches will be positioned with a least 5 meters distance so that you won't really have the other stream in your field of vision.

There were people speaking all the time in the stream room at normal talking levels without runners being distracted. And what about races? Those all worked out fine in all previous marathons? The only potential issue you mention is that it might be messy? Play with the thought that it won't be, where do you stand then?

MrLonghair

Edit history:

MrLonghair: 2013-11-22 03:08:21 pm

2013-11-22 03:07:42 pm

Baldioengineer

Personal goal: To never have anybody go "there's nothing interesting for me right now on either stream".

Audio: Nothing to add. Compressor-limiter units are required, with a noise suppression function especially if crowd micing is wanted.

Runners: Were too quiet.

Donation comments: Really fucking tricky. Would prefer a ticker display shared between both streams reading up only larger more remarkable donations/incentives to individual streams.

Isolation: Sound isolating blanket thingamajigger between the couches of runners and commentators I guess, if going with one room.

Serious time: Brad from Giantbomb needs serious time. If you need serious time for audio-queues, headphones should be provided.

Two rooms: Blueprints of the locales please. I think it could work out, a main room for larger features, a less than main room for other games. Requires good scheduling and planning to prevent people from just sitting in one stream all the time. Make viewers and attendees move around, dudebro speedrun A cutesy B followed in schedule by cutesy in room A, dudebro in room B, like.

Two rooms allow for far more interesting behind the scenes and third-stream/pirate stream work.

[b]Personal goal:[/b] To never have anybody go "there's nothing interesting for me right now on either stream".

[b]Audio:[/b] Nothing to add. Compressor-limiter units are required, with a noise suppression function especially if crowd micing is wanted.

[b]Runners:[/b] Were too quiet.

[b]Donation comments:[/b] Really fucking tricky. Would prefer a ticker display shared between both streams reading up only larger more remarkable donations/incentives to individual streams.

[b]Isolation:[/b] Sound isolating blanket thingamajigger between the couches of runners and commentators I guess, if going with one room.

[b]Serious time[/b]: Brad from Giantbomb needs serious time. If you need serious time for audio-queues, headphones should be provided.

[b]Two rooms:[/b] Blueprints of the locales please. I think it could work out, a main room for larger features, a less than main room for other games. Requires good scheduling and planning to prevent people from just sitting in one stream all the time. Make viewers and attendees move around, dudebro speedrun A cutesy B followed in schedule by cutesy in room A, dudebro in room B, like.

Two rooms allow for far more interesting behind the scenes and third-stream/pirate stream work.

Edenal

2013-11-22 03:30:47 pm

Two room / One room: Having two rooms will effectively require twice the man power to run the streams. That's my big concern. Especially during graveyard shifts. (Dips on morning shifts again btw!)

In this case I believe it's worth the extra potential messiness to keep the streams in one room, to relieve the stress of those who are working the tech stations. Because they want to enjoy other aspects of the marathon too!

curseddolls

2013-11-22 04:08:51 pm

100% gamer

You cant really use the vs races as an example since they then played the same game.
Its a big difference between that and play two dif games next to each other since with that comes
also (at least) two commentaries with that. And I don't talk about just stream messiness.
I talk about room messiness, where people will be talking over each other, maybe
interrupt each other and as jasper say disturb each other when one or the other need a serious time for
a specific hard trick in that particular game.

The idea is a nice one but it has it flaws and we/you have to smooth them out before settling down for it to 100%.

MrLonghair

Edit history:

MrLonghair: 2013-11-22 05:04:05 pm

2013-11-22 05:03:35 pm

Baldioengineer

You can speak in an ordinary relaxed voice with the mics, that's something I'd like to bring up. Excited times will happen, but those who need serious time, Edenal, what were the wise words you and I had about those a while back?

While shopping I thought of a cubicle-like set of dividing walls, they block sound and vision and with good placement of things there'll be no real problems. Separate so runners cannot see each other or their TVs. Those dividing walls exist already at the location. Trasmattor = increased sound dampening.

Edenal

Edit history:

Edenal: 2013-11-22 05:45:09 pm

2013-11-22 05:43:24 pm

Is it necessary to preform this super hard trick?
I personally believe serious time is overrated, and routes should be marathon safe. There are circumstances there a runner does need audio queues, like Nev's blindfolded run. But that can be handled with headphones.

I can't think of that many moments during ESA's history when serious time has been needed. Care to remind me?

I think the serious time discussion comes down to what is good enough for serious time? What really qualifies as serious time. Should the whole room stop existing or is it enough that the couch commentators and anyone within a couple of meters turns silent? Things like that usually works itself out when the runner gets so emerged in the game during an intensive boss fight that he/she won't be bothered with what goes on around them.

Invoking serious time too frequently is a problem AGDQ has been having. And people are not taking it as serious anymore. And that affects the stream in a negative way.

Also, please be more specific when pointing out flaws and suggestion work-arounds or solutions.

Is it necessary to preform this super hard trick? 
I personally believe serious time is overrated, and routes should be marathon safe. There are circumstances there a runner does need audio queues, like Nev's blindfolded run. But that can be handled with headphones.

I can't think of that many moments during ESA's history when serious time has been needed. Care to remind me?

I think the serious time discussion comes down to what is good enough for serious time? What really qualifies as serious time. Should the whole room stop existing or is it enough that the couch commentators and anyone within a couple of meters turns silent? Things like that usually works itself out when the runner gets so emerged in the game during an intensive boss fight that he/she won't be bothered with what goes on around them.

Invoking serious time too frequently is a problem AGDQ has been having. And people are not taking it as serious anymore. And that affects the stream in a negative way.

Also, please be more specific when pointing out flaws and suggestion work-arounds or solutions.

OC!

2013-11-23 12:40:57 am

twitch.tv/OC1_

With 2 streams going on in 2 separate rooms, there's risking 2 next-to-empty rooms during graveyard shifts, if the schedule isn't extremely balanced. If it's possible to have them in the same room audio/tech-wise I think that would be better to increase the feeling of that both streams are lively at all times. Maybe stream #2 could be the stream for longer games and 100% and such.

PresJPolk

2013-11-23 12:55:15 am

Re: Serious time, I can easily see situations where there's a delicate moment in the run, where a sudden loud cheering from the other stream would be a distraction.

ozzy88

Edit history:

ozzy88: 2013-11-23 03:55:49 pm

2013-11-23 03:54:55 pm

Quote from PresJPolk:

Re: Serious time, I can easily see situations where there's a delicate moment in the run, where a sudden loud cheering from the other stream would be a distraction.

I gotta agree.

Quote from Edenal:

Is it necessary to preform this super hard trick?

Yes. In SotN for instance, what do I do if I can't hit Richter Skip? Well I can't move on and have to lose like at least 10 minutes. Although, it has been made easier by new discoveries really recently.

But I might just want to have that as a donation war (Wolf VS Bat)

In my opinion we should skip having 2 streams running during the graveyard shift.

There usually isn't a lot of people around to watch the run (you'd be stretching them thinner) and the tech crew has in the past been more or less gone during those hours (hopefully not a problem this year). I mean, give the people working with the marathon stations a break.

I'm currently more for the streams being in separate rooms. Feels like a more solid plan to me.

[quote="PresJPolk"]Re: Serious time, I can easily see situations where there's a delicate moment in the run, where a sudden loud cheering from the other stream would be a distraction.[/quote]

I gotta agree.

[quote="Edenal"]Is it necessary to preform this super hard trick? [/quote]

Yes. In SotN for instance, what do I do if I can't hit Richter Skip? Well I can't move on and have to lose like at least 10 minutes. Although, it has been made easier by new discoveries really recently.

But I might just want to have that as a donation war (Wolf VS Bat)

In my opinion we should skip having 2 streams running during the graveyard shift.

There usually isn't a lot of people around to watch the run (you'd be stretching them thinner) and the tech crew has in the past been more or less gone during those hours (hopefully not a problem this year). I mean, give the people working with the marathon stations a break.

I'm currently more for the streams being in separate rooms. Feels like a more solid plan to me.

j4sp3rr

2013-11-23 04:07:19 pm

the seperate room is the more solid plan(in my own honest opinion), but then i would feel it's the best to use KVD's suggestion as well to have only 1 stream online on overly hyped games, or just have the seconds stream output the same thing at that time(restream or whatever) this is to prevent a smaller runner from isolation because, for example, adam_ak or robosparkle are running in the other room and everyone is watching over there

if you put up walls between the runners you are seperating them anyways and the crowd still has to pick one or the other side of the wall anyways

Edenal

2013-11-23 05:25:24 pm

Separating the two streams is the most effective way to make one of them into a "B"-stream.

curseddolls

2013-11-23 07:34:08 pm

100% gamer

well people said u could have the long speedruns on one of them.. do those require any special moments for
serious time tricks?

j4sp3rr

2013-11-23 07:40:05 pm

thing is having only longer games on there, you'd run out of em and the longer games will only be looked at a bit or muted so idk how much attention the longer games will get but no they might not take too many serious time tricks possibly, although fights in rpg's can be really hard and you can lose a LOT of time losing them

PresJPolk

2013-11-23 08:06:29 pm

Well not everyone would mute the RPG stream. It all depends on what games' on the other stream. You know there are whole, successful marathons that are nothing but RPGs. :)

But having a second stream as a long games stream is something I supported all along.